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Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer

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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#21

Posted: December 29, 2014, 5:24 PM Post
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Posts: 959
young guns said:
You may feel that its a coincidence that Detroit scored 2 td in the 2 possessions between snaps taken by Rodgers and only 1 in every other possession, but I dont.


Brad Jones' terrible penalty caused the first TD, not Rodgers' injury...but I can buy that the whole team was a bit deflated when # 12 went down.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#22

Posted: December 29, 2014, 10:14 PM Post
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It helps when MVP is defined. Until then, we are arguing mutiple definitions depending upon what it means to us.

If you are looking at what individual player, regardless of position, with their 2014 performance would you rather have on your team, the answer is Aaron Rodgers.

If you are looking at what invididual player, regardless of position, with their 2014 performance was more above replacement value, the answer is JJ Watt. At QB alone, Roethlisberger had a better DYAR and Romo had a better QBR.

Aruging that Texans are 9-7 and Packers are 12-4 is irrelvant to me. Different schedules and different circumstances in a team dependent sport. I prefer metric #2 when naming an MVP. Nobody did what Watt did this season. There were a few of QB's in the same neighborhood as Rodgers.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#23

Posted: December 30, 2014, 12:24 PM Post
Posts: 1655
And why exactly did the best defensive run team allow us to run all over them? Because they were so afraid of Rodgers throwing the ball all over them. That is the kind of impact he has for the team.

Maybe, but I think that is selling our line and backs short. I think the fact that Lacy managed to do pretty well last season when Rodgers was out shows they can in fact create on their own.

He takes the best run defense and turns them into our defense.


That is supposed to be bad? You do realize our defense has actually played pretty well since Matthews moved inside don't you?

And I do believe his absence had an effect on the defense. With Rodgers this team plays loose. They don't think they have to play perfect in order to win the game.


Then please explain why the defense hasn't always been good and playing loose since Rodgers has been here. I could as easily argue the reverse is true. That they play with less intensity because they don't have to worry about letting a team score.

In fact Barrington said after the game on the radio that Rodgers being carted off the field DID have a negative effect on them.

I think players say all kinds of things that don't necessarily mean much. It's player speak meant to be politically correct more than give true insight. I think had Flynn had to finish the game the response would have been something along the line of Rodgers doesn't play defense, we have to do our job, and we all have confidence in Flynn so it's just next man up yada yada yada. At least that is how they spoke last season when Flynn was in there.

You may feel that its a coincidence that Detroit scored 2 td in the 2 possessions between snaps taken by Rodgers and only 1 in every other possession, but I dont.


I just don't buy into the idea that a team suddenly loses all hope, focus, drive what ever you want to call it when a single player goes down on the opposite side of the ball. Regardless of who that player is. I think that is an insult to the players in question. I think Rodgers is the best QB in the game today but I think even he would admit he isn't the sole reason this team is so good. I certainly don't buy into the idea that the defense suddenly changes by Rodgers being in or out.

By the way I forgot to mention Stafford missed a wide open Megatron that would have been a TD while Rodgers was playing. So the defense lucks out when the opposing QB misses a wide open receiver and gives up a TD late and allows Detroit to get back into the game when Rodgers was playing. Seems to me either Rodgers motivation on the defense comes and goes every few series or he has nothing to do with it. I think most of the evidence points to the latter.

The artist formerly known as BUC.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#24

Posted: January 01, 2015, 10:14 AM Post
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Posts: 1105
Watt didn't lead the league in sacks - Justin Houston did with 22. There were people in the same neighborhood as Watt too.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#25

Posted: January 01, 2015, 5:53 PM Post
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LouisEly said:
Watt didn't lead the league in sacks - Justin Houston did with 22. There were people in the same neighborhood as Watt too.


Sure...if one is closed-minded and looks strictly at sacks. From an total picture, impact standpoint, nobody was in the same neighborhood as JJ Watt. I'd be shocked if he doesn't win atleast 30% of the vote.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#26

Posted: January 02, 2015, 3:59 PM Post
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Posts: 162
Location: Dallas, TX
lcbj68c said:
It helps when MVP is defined. Until then, we are arguing mutiple definitions depending upon what it means to us.

If you are looking at what individual player, regardless of position, with their 2014 performance would you rather have on your team, the answer is Aaron Rodgers.

If you are looking at what invididual player, regardless of position, with their 2014 performance was more above replacement value, the answer is JJ Watt. At QB alone, Roethlisberger had a better DYAR and Romo had a better QBR.

Aruging that Texans are 9-7 and Packers are 12-4 is irrelvant to me. Different schedules and different circumstances in a team dependent sport. I prefer metric #2 when naming an MVP. Nobody did what Watt did this season. There were a few of QB's in the same neighborhood as Rodgers.


LOL, Romo's QBR was 82.7. Rodgers was 82.6. I don't know if Romo's was better than Rodgers. Rodgers maintained that same level of play with a lesser line, run game, no tight end to speak of, a tougher schedule, and far more games outdoors.

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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#27

Posted: January 02, 2015, 4:57 PM Post
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You're using DYAR to say that Rothlesberger is in the same neighborhood as Rodgers.

And I don't know how they calculate QBR, but when you look at the components of it, Rodgers has by far the highest Total EPA, QB PAR (which I think is sort of the equivalent of a WAR stat in baseball), and QB PAA of any QB in the league. How that translates to a similar QBR as Romo I have no idea.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#28

Posted: January 03, 2015, 2:49 PM Post
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It was my understanding that DYAR was similiar to WAR in baseball. Either way, there are QB's in the "neighborhood" of what Rodgers provided.


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  Re: Greetings, everybody. The 2014 NFL MVP...the picture is becoming clearer
#29

Posted: January 04, 2015, 5:11 PM Post
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I just find it funny that most people (fans, media, etc.) were saying Rodgers was far and away the MVP, that was having this other-worldly season and then he has an off game at Buffalo and it's all like, "OH NO THE NARRATIVE HAS CHANGED!"


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